Post Mortem on Saban and Harbaugh

[UTK66]

Not at all. But it's ironic that we're talking about agendas while forcing an idea with zero substance but saying the idea is correct, like an agenda.

I wasn't talking about an agenda.

 

[PJB]

I'm not too concerned about the process and am excited about Charlie Strong. His selection and his interest is logical to me. He was a successful DC. He was successful at L'ville as a HC. To be successful there is a big deal to me considering it is smack in the middle of a lot of other good football schools and Kentucky is a small state. L'ville served as his stepping stone to a big job at the same level of Alabama, Fla, OU, etc.

As for the rumors of Saban, I never understood the logic. Saban already has a great deal coaching at a top football school with great recruiting resources in the Southeast. The only thing that made sense to me was that his agent may have created "competitive friction" by claiming he might go to UT, thus motivating Alabama to improve his contract.

As for Fisher; it would have been unprecedented that a coach from a team in the MNC with a Heisman QB would leave his team. Never made sense to me. His agent may have used the "other school" interest to improve his contract too. I know many would say $8MM would entice him but I disagree that the $$ is that important to these guys. They can't come close to spending what they make now. Money ceases to be a great motivator at some point.

 

[Sirhornsalot]

I wasn't talking about an agenda.

Well, Strong WAS a fallback option. Patterson was told by the BMDs to go to Saban first. He did. Sounds like the BMDs wielded their influence on Patterson there.

Once Patterson had done due diligence for the BMD's choice, he went his own way. That does not show any type of rebellion towards BMDs. He did exactly what they asked him to.

If Strong had been the primary target and first choice, this hire goes down much ealier. There was nothing stopping the hire - except the Saban offer.

You're free to look at it however you want. I was just trying to correct a misconception.

 

[UTK66]

Interesting:

@kbohls: Texas AD Steve Patterson tells me he offered "one person" the job in Strong, says Alabama's Nick Saban was never a candidate for job.

 

[athenslawyer]

Over a year ago, I told my UT buddies we need Charlie Strong or a coach like him. Once the talk of Saban started, I jumped on that bandwagon. Don't care why Saban or any other guy didn't come to Texas. Coach Strong is our coach now and I'm 110% behind him. I think we're about to see a Texas football team like no others. And that excites the hell out of me.

 

[Sirhornsalot]

Interesting:
@kbohls: Texas AD Steve Patterson tells me he offered "one person" the job in Strong, says Alabama's Nick Saban was never a candidate for job.

Bohls. LOL

 

[BBQ time]

There is only ever one provable fact in a coaching search. Who got the job.

Everything else is propaganda. Everyone has an agenda. Fans, opposing fans, opposing coaches, media.

 

[theknighttrain]

Vertuno said it too. Makes Briles cya very comical now.

 

[Alouha27]

I'm fine with your stance. I'll stick with mine. Patterson's performance says nothing about whether or not these millionaire donors have access. They always have, they always will, regardless of the sheriff.
I'll go even further and say this idea that Patterson somehow wants them shut out is just bogus. The first time one of them is asked to write a check, the non-access would come up and would be addressed, but it will never get to that because there will be no effort to shut them out.

Some of you are acting like this is gospel and it's not even a friggin rumor.

I agree with you. There is no way in hell anybody tries to shut out the folks who pay the bills. You don't bite the hand that feeds.

 

[MBHORNSFAN]

Interesting:
@kbohls: Texas AD Steve Patterson tells me he offered "one person" the job in Strong, says Alabama's Nick Saban was never a candidate for job.

I am not a Bohls fan but based on what I have heard from people I trust. I tend to believe this now. With that said who cares now. I support Strong.

 

[NLeininger]

Saban was in play because of sexton, sexton not only got saban a raise, but also got fisher a raise. Fisher was never going to leave fsu doesn't make sense, same for saban look at the class he has coming in.
We got played by the best agent in the business right now, and congrats to him for getting his guy raises.

that being said I love strong, 100 percent behind him lets go horns.

Texas didn't get played. The BMD's that went after him got played.

 

[MBHORNSFAN]

Well, Strong WAS a fallback option. Patterson was told by the BMDs to go to Saban first. He did. Sounds like the BMDs wielded their influence on Patterson there.
Once Patterson had done due diligence for the BMD's choice, he went his own way. That does not show any type of rebellion towards BMDs. He did exactly what they asked him to.

If Strong had been the primary target and first choice, this hire goes down much ealier. There was nothing stopping the hire - except the Saban offer.

You're free to look at it however you want. I was just trying to correct a misconception.[/quote

No doubt that Saban probably got a phone call from Patterson but after that, that was it.

 

[NLeininger]

I'm going to disagree.
Jesus' Big Cigar said Dodds would retire. OB said Dodds would not retire. Burton said Dodds would not retire and would be back next year.

Jesus then says not only will he retire, he'll first say he won't retire, then he'll retire between this date and that date.

Jesus' Cigar was right. Dodds retired. OB, Burton were flat wrong. Where is the agenda? What agenda could that be?

I seriously, seriously doubt that these folks are going to have less access. These people call Patterson by his first name.

My post had nothing to do with Dodds, but with the coaching search and as it pertains to names getting leaked by Shuttleworth, Burton, Chip, and McPhaul. I even said coaching search in my post.

I appreciate what you heard though, you are a great guy.

I do have a question to ask. This past summer in Houston it was bad, and I under-watered my backyard. I have spots I need to replace. When is the best time to plant new bermuda grass? I usually use the pallets from Home Depot.

 

[TexasFirst1]

Mack and Jamail were pissed that Saban's agent was talking to Hicks and others while Mack was still coach. Powers and Patterson botched the Mack Brown exit and soured Saban on their competence and the influence of Jamail and Mack going forward. Patterson was unwilling to up Saban's compensation above his new contract level and Saban decided that he did not want to deal with the whole Mack/Jamail aftermath. Saban wanted a clean break with Mack in the best interests of the future. Patterson thought the bad blood would be an issue going forward and Mack deserved to remain part of the UT "family" if he wanted to.

Patterson felt Sexton was just playing UT to get big raises for Saban, Malzahn and Fisher. Patterson refused to deal through Sexton with Malzahn and Fisher. Fisher was very interested but wanted to defer until after the MNC game. In truth, Patterson went through the motions on Saban to placate certain BMDs and never seriously pursued Malzahn, Fisher, Briles or John Harbaugh. Patterson felt Harbaugh was too far removed from recruiting and the college football realm and would not better his current $7 million deal. Patterson gave Briles a disrespectful interview only offer that he had to refuse.

Patterson settled on Strong early and never seriously pursued anyone else. Patterson is betting his job and the future of UT football and the LHN on a coach who 1) loathes media interface 2) has never been a head coach at a major conference school, 3) has never won a major conference championship as a head coach, 4) has never recruited 4-5 star talent in large numbers as a head coach, 5) has not produced large numbers of NFL players as a head coach, 5) has almost no recruiting ties to Texas and 6) has had major difficulties fielding strong offenses even with Bridgewater, 7) runs a more pro style offense that does not well match Texas high schools.

The best news about Strong is that he seems to be a brilliant defensive mind and solid fundamentals coach who completely shut down the white hot OU offense as the DC for Florida in the 2008 season MNC game. Everything else about Strong is a huge roll of the dice.

Anything is possible with Strong and it may work out but Patterson's process was unprofessional, high risk and did not seriously pursue the best available outcome for UT.

 

[MBHORNSFAN]

Mack and Jamail were pissed that Saban's agent was talking to Hicks and others while Mack was still coach. Powers and Patterson botched the Mack Brown exit and soured Saban on their competence and the influence of Jamail and Mack going forward. Patterson was unwilling to up Saban's compensation above his new contract level and Saban decided that he did not want to deal with the whole Mack/Jamail aftermath. Saban wanted a clean break with Mack in the best interests of the future. Patterson thought the bad blood would be an issue going forward and Mack deserved to remain part of the UT "family" if he wanted to.
Patterson felt Sexton was just playing UT to get big raises for Saban, Malzahn and Fisher. Patterson refused to deal through Sexton with Malzahn and Fisher. Fisher was very interested but wanted to defer until after the MNC game. In truth, Patterson went through the motions on Saban to placate certain BMDs and never seriously pursued Malzahn, Fisher, Briles or John Harbaugh. Patterson felt Harbaugh was too far removed from recruiting and the college football realm and would not better his current $7 million deal. Patterson gave Briles a disrespectful interview only offer that he had to refuse.

Patterson settled on Strong early and never seriously pursued anyone else. Patterson is betting his job and the future of UT football and the LHN on a coach who 1) loathes media interface 2) has never been a head coach at a major conference school, 3) has never won a major conference championship, 4) has never recruited 4-5 star talent in large numbers as a head coach, 5) has not produced large numbers of NFL players as a head coach, 5) has almost no recruiting ties to Texas and 6) has had major difficulties fielding strong offenses even with Bridgewater, 7) runs a more pro style offense that does not well match Texas high schools.

The best news about Strong is that he seems to be a brilliant defensive mind and solid fundamentals coach who completely shut down the white hot OU offense as the DC for Florida in the 2008 season MNC game. Everything else about Strong is a huge roll of the dice.

Anything is possible with Strong and it may work out but Patterson's process was unprofessional, high risk and did not seriously pursue the best available outcome for UT.

Good post, the only part that we really don't know for sure is the part about Mack. Maybe people released this a smear campaign.. who know

 

[Alouha27]

My post had nothing to do with Dodds, but with the coaching search and as it pertains to names getting leaked by Shuttleworth, Burton, Chip, and McPhaul. I even said coaching search in my post.
I appreciate what you heard though, you are a great guy.

I do have a question to ask. This past summer in Houston it was bad, and I under-watered my backyard. I have spots I need to replace. When is the best time to plant new bermuda grass? I usually use the pallets from Home Depot.

Here in Houston my advice would be to install turf in the yard and live like the Brady Bunch! Damn near kill myself every summer taking care of the lawn! Lol

 

[KellyUT4Ever]

Appeared a large portion of the fan base would have been excited to get Saban. That portion of the fan base would probably like to know if Saban was diligently pursued by Patterson subsequent to Mack announcing his resignation and if Saban actually turned down the opportunity subsequent to Mack's resignation. Kind of hard to support Patterson if you don't know why it's Strong when there has been no formal indication since Mack resigned that Saban or Harbaugh or Fisher for that matter, had no interest in the job.
Strong may well have been the best choice but I don't think many will buy that without knowing what transpired with the other top choices that have been discussed ad nauseam. Patterson would have to be totally clueless to not know that Strong was not on top of anybody's wish list except maybe his. He would have to also be totally clueless if he thinks he is going to have any credibility with the fan base if they don't know what happened with the other choices. Even Strong has to know he wasn't being discussed by the Texas fan base as the must have guy. What made Strong the choice over Saban, Fisher, Harbaugh, and why he had to be offered the prior to the MNC game? If Fisher said "no interest" then great. If Saban said "no thanks" then great.

I've been buying season tickets for 25 years, traveling to away games, bowl games etc. etc. all the devoted alumni stuff, and I'm not buying "we went out and got the best coach", I want to know why it's not the other top choices. I imagine many others do as well. Strong's support will be tenuous if the product is not markedly improved quickly if the fan base is left thinking we could have had a coach with MNCs, Super Bowls, or at least a loss in the MNC. If I can't buy into Strong as the best "available" choice before Jan 15th, I certainly can't buy into Patterson. "best available choice before the 15th" being the operative phrase (Patterson's stated date), Patterson didn't say Jan 4th.

I hope Strong kills it but I'm left thinking we could have had a more proven coach. Oh well, glad I got that out of my system.

Great post and thank you for sharing your perspective. Like you we are tenured foundation donors, season tickets holders and travel to most away games. I was expecting a bigger hire, and wasn't prepared initially for this decision. I questioned if we would continue even with our seats being on the 1st row, 50 yard line.

The past 4-5 years have taken a toll on the fan base, no question about it. I'd like to think that Patterson would share his thoughts and transparency on the decision making. It sure would win some folks over, and communication would be welcomed.

While this drama was unfolding I did a little research myself on Strong and what I read was impressive. Impressive for U of L, Texas, I couldn't imagine it. While there was a poster accusing me of being negative, he couldn't be further from the truth. I like you just want us to have a chance and winning is always nice. Unlike this same poster, we do have choices. We don't have to donate- or be an ass pay the foundation dues and sell your tickets to the opponent like a large group of alums that set around us. It's just a fact.

The more I've read the more I like Strong and we want to give him a chance, he deserves it. It's a big job with the highest of expectations. It took a few days to digest, research and educate ourselves having said that, concluded that we want to support Coach Strong in his new endeavor. So for now, our HORNS are UP and welcome our new coach and family to Austin.

 

[Sirhornsalot]

My post had nothing to do with Dodds, but with the coaching search and as it pertains to names getting leaked by Shuttleworth, Burton, Chip, and McPhaul. I even said coaching search in my post.
I appreciate what you heard though, you are a great guy.

I do have a question to ask. This past summer in Houston it was bad, and I under-watered my backyard. I have spots I need to replace. When is the best time to plant new bermuda grass? I usually use the pallets from Home Depot.

My point was that these folks didn't start doing this upon a coaching search. JS has been doing this for years. But thanks for the compliment, you're an enjoyable personality here yourself.

You can go ahead and sod right now. It's dormant but will emerge like any other turf when spring arrives.

Before doing so, prep your area for it but include a product called "expanded shale." It's pea gravel sized (a tad smaller) shale that's been cooked to where it has contraction/expansion capabilities. Keeps the subsurface aerated and retains moisture. Makes your lawn more drought tolerant for the long run. Expanded Shale can be found at Calloways and feed stores and nurseries. Don't settle for the elaborate substitutes if you are pushed that way. None of them beat plain ole expanded shale. The shale's cheaper anyway, about $6 a bag. Use 1 bag for an area half the size of your living room.

Find a turf dealer in your area. The pricing and quality of turf there will be far better than what you get at HD.

If you sod now, wet it thoroughly on install, then twice a week for a couple weeks. Skip a watering if you get a rainfall.