Ohio State offense

[utisdabomb12]

I wish somebody in the football industry would sit down and categorize/discuss the Ohio State offense in great depth.  

They certainly run spread looks but they also run a lot of base run formations where they only spread 2 or 3 wide. The most interesting thing about Ohio State's offense is pre-snap. They really have a lot of motion pre-snap. Last night I saw a RB motion, a TE motion. HB motion, and WR motion. Motion from all over the field. It really had the LBers and secondary confused in the Bama and Oregon games. The other interesting thing about the offense are the WR sets. I don't think I've ever seen so many formations before. They really don't run complicated routes but they run some very unique sets pre-snap, and the fact they have so many WR formations is pretty incredible. 

The Ohio State offense is a good bit different than what Meyer ran at Florida. I'm not sure if it's the work of Herman or what. All I know is it has a certain stroke of genius to it. I'm not even sure what you categorize the offense as, and I've never seen some of the motions/WR sets they run. 

 

[utisdabomb12]

The other interesting thing about the Ohio State offense is it's almost like the coaches don't want the offensive line to go 2nd level (meaning blocking the LBers). They want the O-line to win its battles on the defensive line, even if that means doubling and letting the LBers roam free. I think the offense almost relies on the pre motion and WR schemes to win the battle at the LB/DB level. 

Incredibly unique offense. Would be a hell of a case study. 

 

[Worster1]

What I was most impressed with last night, was the bucks OL (and vs. 'bama)  - they are huge and DOMINATED the ducks D most of the night. They picked up the stunts and blitzes pretty well, gave the QB time to throw most of the time and opened big holes for the RB's.  This is the level CS and Wickline need to recruit and coach the UT OL to.

 

[Coleman Feeley]

They certainly run spread looks but they also run a lot of base run formations where they only spread 2 or 3 wide. The most

The Ohio State offense is a good bit different than what Meyer ran at Florida. I'm not sure if it's the work of Herman or what. All I know is it has a certain stroke of genius to it. I'm not even sure what you categorize the offense as, and I've never seen some of the motions/WR sets they run. 

The Ohio State offense is the next step in prolific College offenses'. The Buckeye's were able to run the ball consistently in many different formations all by creating favorable match-ups in the box (that... plus a dominate performance from the Offensive Line and a QB that SHOULD NOT have been a 3rd stringer).

Ohio State had a lot of moving parts like you mentioned but, they were also able to get blockers out in front of their runners and pullers up to the second level. I have never seen a team pull so many offensive lineman that didn't run an offense similar to Stanford, Wisconsin, or Nebraska of old. It seemed like any play that was designed to run off-tackle had at least one puller. Powers, sweeps, counters, and even some Zone Read plays all included pulling guards or U-Backs (wings). I was fortunate enough to not really care much for either team and just enjoy the game as a contest. However....as an ex-offensive lineman I could NOT have been happier watching the big boys at OSU MAN-HANDLE Oregon.

"There are no bad play calls... only bad blocking" 

 

[DocHorn]

The Ohio State offense is the next step in prolific College offenses'. The Buckeye's were able to run the ball consistently in many different formations all by creating favorable match-ups in the box (that... plus a dominate performance from the Offensive Line and a QB that SHOULD NOT have been a 3rd stringer).

Ohio State had a lot of moving parts like you mentioned but, they were also able to get blockers out in front of their runners and pullers up to the second level. I have never seen a team pull so many offensive lineman that didn't run an offense similar to Stanford, Wisconsin, or Nebraska of old. It seemed like any play that was designed to run off-tackle had at least one puller. Powers, sweeps, counters, and even some Zone Read plays all included pulling guards or U-Backs (wings). I was fortunate enough to not really care much for either team and just enjoy the game as a contest. However....as an ex-offensive lineman I could NOT have been happier watching the big boys at OSU MAN-HANDLE Oregon.

"There are no bad play calls... only bad blocking" 

So you're saying, blocking matters?  Wow, from reading message boards this fall, all the message board experts were telling everyone that the scheme " the spread" is the key to winning.  Good to hear that blocking still counts

 

[86MEHorn]

The Ohio State offense is the next step in prolific College offenses'. The Buckeye's were able to run the ball consistently in many different formations all by creating favorable match-ups in the box (that... plus a dominate performance from the Offensive Line and a QB that SHOULD NOT have been a 3rd stringer).

Ohio State had a lot of moving parts like you mentioned but, they were also able to get blockers out in front of their runners and pullers up to the second level. I have never seen a team pull so many offensive lineman that didn't run an offense similar to Stanford, Wisconsin, or Nebraska of old. It seemed like any play that was designed to run off-tackle had at least one puller. Powers, sweeps, counters, and even some Zone Read plays all included pulling guards or U-Backs (wings). I was fortunate enough to not really care much for either team and just enjoy the game as a contest. However....as an ex-offensive lineman I could NOT have been happier watching the big boys at OSU MAN-HANDLE Oregon.

"There are no bad play calls... only bad blocking" 

Watching Oregon rush 3 and drop 8 at the beginning was amusing. Each guy was double-teamed and they never got close. It was like watching the Ticket Oak commercial (whistles, checks watch...).

 

[utisdabomb12]

The Ohio State offense is the next step in prolific College offenses'. The Buckeye's were able to run the ball consistently in many different formations all by creating favorable match-ups in the box (that... plus a dominate performance from the Offensive Line and a QB that SHOULD NOT have been a 3rd stringer).

Ohio State had a lot of moving parts like you mentioned but, they were also able to get blockers out in front of their runners and pullers up to the second level. I have never seen a team pull so many offensive lineman that didn't run an offense similar to Stanford, Wisconsin, or Nebraska of old. It seemed like any play that was designed to run off-tackle had at least one puller. Powers, sweeps, counters, and even some Zone Read plays all included pulling guards or U-Backs (wings). I was fortunate enough to not really care much for either team and just enjoy the game as a contest. However....as an ex-offensive lineman I could NOT have been happier watching the big boys at OSU MAN-HANDLE Oregon.

"There are no bad play calls... only bad blocking" 

Yeah the offensive line is interesting. I was focusing on the tackles and it seemed to me like they stay contained for the most part and didn't push to the second level. It's interesting that you bring up the fact about the pulling guards (something I didn't really notice but I really wasn't paying all that much attention). 

Would you say they use more movement on the O-line in comparison to other teams? Specifically the guards?  I'm honestly not well versed in blocking schemes. From my perspective it seemed like the the tackles were staying contained and the guards were used much more in terms of "pulling" on the sweeps and counters. In other words, the movement on the o-line was coming more from the interior. I could be dead wrong but isn't that against the norm? 

I'm guessing the movement on the O-line is similar to the motions pre-snap? Creates havoc and forces the d-line/lbers to guess. 

 

[echeese]

Coleman,

thanks for that post. . .

Couple questions. . .1st how hard is it to pull so many players, OLs and TEs?

Do the counters compliment the zone reads well?

While at different levels, it appears we are trying to do many of the things they do,clearly we don't have the talent. . .would you agree with that?

And last

tOSU experienced huge turnover this year along the OL. . . .why were they able to better adjust as the season went on?

Was hoping you'd be around this AM

 

[Coleman Feeley]

Great Questions! Ohio State's offensive line is

A. Obviously well coached

B. MEAN!

Not only did they handle individual assignments very well, they constantly communicated and identified blitzes which all helped Jones' take his time in the pocket. Many of Jones' scrambles were made after 3-5 seconds in the pocket... can't ask for much more than that. As for the pulling schemes, Oregon's defense assisted in that.

Back in the days of Lombardi and the Packer Sweep (pulling both guards) defenses played 5 man defensive lines that consisted of a Tackle over the Center, Two additional DTs over Offensive Tackles and Ends outside of the Tight-Ends (most offensive formations were two tight). This opened up natural spaces so when pulling a guard you don't necessarily clear a running lane so that defenders can blow up plays for negative yards.

Oregon's 3 man D-Line presented similar opportunities for OSU. By manning up the Tackles (and having them win those battles) it opened up multiple running lanes that Guards could pull up into and block 2nd and even 3rd level defenders. Ezekiel Elliot had great patience and followed his blockers to a 4 TD 246 yard performance.

As for being mean... those big boys FINISHED defenders. BODIES ON THE GROUND! I say 'mean' because as a defender you know when you have been blocked and as a blocker you know when the ball has moved past you, you don't have to finish the guy, but the best feeling in the world is pancaking someone and OSU's O-Line was feeling GREAT at the end of this one!

 

[doc longhorn]

What I was most impressed with last night, was the bucks OL (and vs. 'bama)  - they are huge and DOMINATED the ducks D most of the night. They picked up the stunts and blitzes pretty well, gave the QB time to throw most of the time and opened big holes for the RB's.  This is the level CS and Wickline need to recruit and coach the UT OL to.

Thank you!

 

[Coleman Feeley]

Coleman,

thanks for that post. . .

Couple questions. . .1st how hard is it to pull so many players, OLs and TEs?

Do the counters compliment the zone reads well?

While at different levels, it appears we are trying to do many of the things they do,clearly we don't have the talent. . .would you agree with that?

And last

OSU experienced huge turnover this year along the OL. . . .why were they able to better adjust as the season went on?

Was hoping you'd be around this AM

First off thank you, I appreciate the interest!

1) Zones and Counter go together like Lamb and Tuna fish... or spaghetti and meatball if that works better for you?  LB's read blockers more often than RBs or QBS so when a front side LB sees down blocks (which are essentially identical to backside zone blocks) they move backside creating more time for a puller to get there and conversely when a Backside LB see's a puller they run playside and are met by Tackles blocking up to the 2nd level. BOOM... Counter

2) If an offensive lineman ever gets to show off ANY athleticism it's when he's pulling. So, while getting a player coached up on proper pulling technique could be difficult, getting him to hit someone isn't (or shouldn't be). Tight End's, when on the L.O.S. rarely pull because pulling the end man ensures the Defender on that side will chase the play down from behind (unless there's a read which OSU did too). When off the L.O.S. I would expect them to not be blocking straight ahead. On and Off the Line for TEs is all about the blocking angles created.

3) Texas is without a DOUBT trying to recreate some of this Offense. Personnel wise we even compared well with OSU this year. BIG QB, solid and tough RBs with a commitment to the Run (early this season). And as for Talent I think it's there it's just young and inexperienced. Two years of playing or even practicing will help you determine whether an End is dropping for a zone blitz or rushing. Is that Safety low? Are there defenders overloaded to one side or are they in man coverage? All scenarios that O-Lineman need to be aware of.

 

[Coleman Feeley]

So you're saying, blocking matters?  Wow, from reading message boards this fall, all the message board experts were telling everyone that the scheme " the spread" is the key to winning.  Good to hear that blocking still counts

"Some people try to find things in this game that don't exist but, football is only two things - BLOCKING and TACKLING" - Lombardi 

 

[86MEHorn]

3) Texas is without a DOUBT trying to recreate some of this Offense. Personnel wise we even compared well with OSU this year. BIG QB, solid and tough RBs with a commitment to the Run (early this season). And as for Talent I think it's there it's just young and inexperienced. Two years of playing or even practicing will help you determine whether an End is dropping for a zone blitz or rushing. Is that Safety low? Are there defenders overloaded to one side or are they in man coverage? All scenarios that O-Lineman need to be aware of.

Good stuff today.

Good to hear on #3. If I'm Strong, I call Meyer today and congratulate him...stoke his ego about how he has taken the baton from Saban. Chit-chat about the good ole days at Florida.

Then, ask when OSU Spring Camp is, and advise I'm sending the entire offensive staff.

 

[Duke C #11]

Another thing I noticed is that not only was the RB for Ohio State tougher than Oregon's linebackers, so was the QB.

 

[J.B. TexasEx]

"There are no bad play calls... only bad blocking" 

Agree, but if you continue to stubbornly run the same vanilla running plays against 9 defenders stacking the box it sure makes it tough on the O-Line!

 

[J.B. TexasEx]

Good stuff today.

Good to hear on #3. If I'm Strong, I call Meyer today and congratulate him...stoke his ego about how he has taken the baton from Saban. Chit-chat about the good ole days at Florida.

Then, ask when OSU Spring Camp is, and advise I'm sending the entire offensive staff.

Amen

 

[Coal Harbour]

Oregon was reluctant to bring a safety up to support the run b/c OSU has playmakers on the outside and Jones has a big arm to make you pay for doing that.  Oregon was simply caught in between most of the game and the combination of OSU's OL and having a versatile offense proved too much for Oregon to stop.  Even when the Ducks guessed right, they seem to lose those one on one battles physically.

Its a nice blueprint to follow, but most teams simply don't have the depth of talent that OSU had.  Alabama had the best defense to stop OSU, but after a couple of long bombs by Jones, even the Tide had to back those safeties off.

 

[Worster1]

Another thing I noticed is that not only was the RB for Ohio State tougher than Oregon's linebackers, so was the QB.

Yup. 

You probably were referring to one play I clearly remember:  osu QB - Jones takes the ball and goes up the middle of the line and hits a duck DL - I think it was a DT or nose tackle and knocks him backwards - wow!

 

[J.B. TexasEx]

Oregon was reluctant to bring a safety up to support the run b/c OSU has playmakers on the outside and Jones has a big arm to make you pay for doing that. 

That was our problem against TCU and Arky - their safeties were coming downhill because they had no fear of getting beaten deep.