Is Saban even a name we talk about?

[Bear19]

I have no doubt that there wasn't contact and communication with Saban's agent. Saban's agent did his job and did it well. Talk about playing someone. He played us.

I have serious doubts that there ever was a chance that Saban was coming to Texas. If he really had wanted to come to Texas he would be here. And we wouldn't be hearing a bunch of damn excuses like we hear with Charlie. Just had to throw that in there.

And, lastly, when all the talk started about Saban, my source told me from day one that Saban was never coming to Texas. And they never wavered one bit on that. My source was always right. Unlike all the other so-called insiders who were right until they were wrong.

Is it the same source who told you we were going to beat Kansas by 30 and I could bank on it? 😎😉

 

[North Texas Golfer]

Is it the same source who told you we were going to beat Kansas by 30 and I could bank on it? 😎😉

No, I have to take full credit for that one. Maybe I should have channeled FDR since he was alive the last time Kansas beat Texas 

Man this is tough crowd. I guess everyone has already forgotten that I pretty much was right on target just the week before about the West Virginia game

I guess it's truly "what have you done for me lately".

 

[tejasrulz]

Is Saban even a name we talk about?

Sure. Such as, I hope the new coach has more success at Texas than Saban did at Bama.

 

[echeese]

We'll let that be your little secret lol. For the rest, here's a story from the New York Times.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/26/sports/ncaafootball/the-pursuit-of-nick-saban-alabama-vs-texas.html

The Pursuit of Nick Saban: Alabama vs. Texas

By MONTE BURKEJULY 25, 2015

NEW YORK TIMES

In December 2012, as Nick Saban was preparing Alabama to face Notre Dame in college football’s national championship game, a University of Texas regent named Wallace Hall received a phone call from a friend.

“It was out of the blue,†Hall says. “He is a U.T. alum, a very well-thought-of, very successful guy who really isn’t a huge fan of football.†The man, whom Hall has refused to name, also happened to be a good friend of Saban’s agent, Jimmy Sexton. “My friend told me, ‘I don’t know how to put this any other way: Nick Saban wants to come to Texas,’ †Hall says.

Hall immediately sent the chairman of the board, Gene Powell, an email, telling him that Sexton wanted to talk. Powell forwarded it to Steve Hicks, a private equity mogul, prominent Texas regent and one of the board’s athletic liaisons. Nothing much came of the correspondence.

After Saban’s Crimson Tide won the national title, Hall contacted Hicks directly. This time Hicks acted on it, calling on his brother Tom, a former owner of Major League Baseball’s Texas Rangers and the National Hockey League’s Dallas Stars. “I had been in pro sports for a long time, so I volunteered to see if this was real or not,†Tom Hicks says.

A few days after the national title game, Hall went to Tom Hicks’s house in Dallas for a scheduled conference call with Sexton. An intermediary had provided Hall with a number for him to reach Sexton, a clever move, Hall believed. “That way, from Jimmy’s perspective, he could always argue that we called him,†he says.

Before the call, Tom Hicks told Hall that Sexton might just be playing Texas to squeeze more money out of Alabama. Hall replied that he doubted that was the case; he pointed out that his friend was friends with Sexton, and he said Sexton wouldn’t want to antagonize him. “I had called my friend,†Hall says, “and asked him if he thought he was being played. He said, ‘No.’ â€

Hall and Tom Hicks talked to Sexton for 45 minutes. They say that Sexton told them that Saban felt “special pressure†and a lack of appreciation at Alabama. “Sexton said that the day after the championship, Alabama boosters were pounding the table, talking about a three-peat,†Hall says.

Sexton also told the men that Saban felt as if he was more of a turnaround artist than a long-term C.E.O., and that it was easier and more fun to rebuild a program than it was to keep one at the top. Saban’s wife, Terry, liked warm weather, so they wanted to stay in the South. Saban also loved lakes, something the Austin area has in abundance. Sexton floated the idea that Saban could take the Texas job, his last; bring the football program back to national prominence; and then retire.

“Jimmy said that winning a national championship at three different universities would be a real legacy,†Tom Hicks said, referring to Saban’s title with Louisiana State. Hall believed that there was serious intent behind Sexton’s call, and that the agent was acting on behalf of an informed client. “No agent is going to go out and do this without consent from Saban,†he says.

Hall and Tom Hicks liked the idea of Saban’s coming to Texas. “It all resonated,†says Hall, who claims he’s not much of a football fan but was mainly intrigued by the potential financial implications of getting Saban. Texas’ athletics had their own cable channel, called the Longhorn Network, a joint venture with ESPN, but it hadn’t quite yet fulfilled the potential envisioned by the university, especially when it came to getting carried by various cable companies. “If someone of Saban’s caliber came to Texas, that would hugely enable ESPN to bring on other affiliates,†Hall says. Yet another university viewed Saban as a vehicle of greater financial growth.

As excited as they were, Hicks and Hall realized they had one significant problem: Texas already had a football coach. Mack Brown — just two months older than Saban — had won a national title at Texas in 2005 and lost another one (to Saban) in 2009, and was entering his 16th season as the Longhorns’ head coach. Hall believed that neither DeLoss Dodds, Texas’ athletic director, nor Bill Powers, the university’s president, was likely to fire Brown. The only way to get Saban to come to Texas, Hicks believed, was to get Brown’s approval and even make it look as if the entire thing was the Texas coach’s idea. He agreed to broach the topic with Brown.

Two days after the call with Sexton, Hicks had lunch with Brown. “I was trying to give him some personal advice,†he says. “I told him he should think about retiring and going out on top and becoming a TV star like he is now. But he didn’t support the idea at all. He didn’t want to retire.â€

Hall believed that a golden opportunity had been squandered. “I am completely convinced that Saban would have come to Texas had Mack approved of the idea, or had DeLoss fired Mack,†he says.

The saga didn’t end there, though.

Sexton’s phone call with Hall and Tom Hicks became public in September 2013, but the details had remained a secret. Not too much was made of the call, and Saban responded to media questions about it by simply saying he was “too damn old to start all over someplace else.†The Texas job, it appeared at the time, might not even open up anyway. Mack Brown, after a tough start to the 2013 season, had righted his own ship and was in the midst of what would become a six-game winning streak.

The real hysteria began in early November when The Associated Press obtained an email written by Tom Hicks about the Sexton call. One sentence in the email stood out: “Sexton confirmed that UT is the only job Nick would possibly consider leaving Alabama for, and that his success there created special pressure for him.â€

At this point, Alabama fans had reason to be worried. The signs disconcertingly echoed ones that, in the past, had led to Saban’s departures: Sexton was out sniffing around, and told the Texas folks almost exactly what he’d once told the Alabama athletics director Mal Moore — that the university was a place he was interested in. (Saban once told a newspaper that without his aggressive agent, “I don’t think I’d ever make one change, the way I am.â€)

Saban was again in denial mode, the inevitable precursor to all of his moves. The unnamed man whom Sexton had contacted to get to Wallace Hall played the role that Sean Tuohy, a business associate, had when Sexton initiated contact with L.S.U. The “special pressure†that Hicks said Saban felt, and the unreasonable expectations that Sexton had detailed in his phone call, harked back to his later years at L.S.U. — the ones Skip Bertman, the L.S.U. athletics director, had warned him about — when a two-loss season suddenly was viewed as a failure. As Sexton had told Hall and Tom Hicks, Saban was indeed most comfortable when he was rebuilding a program — as he had at Toledo, Michigan State, L.S.U., the Miami Dolphins and Alabama — and not maintaining it.

Most significant, Saban was clearly displeased with both the fans (he’d lambasted them in midseason for leaving home games early) and his players in the 2013 season, and he was again feeling underappreciated. Those who knew Saban had long realized that two of the most significant aspects of his career — his “Process†and his near-constant job-hopping — were intertwined at one crucial juncture: Both, at their essence, were about the fact that Saban found it “more invigorating to want than to have,†as David Foster Wallace once wrote.

The Texas football program also seemed to fit Saban’s blueprint. The university, like L.S.U. in 2000 and Alabama in 2007, was desperate to return to national football prominence. Texas had the resources — it had the biggest athletic budget in the country, at $163 million — not only to provide Saban with the largest contract in college football history but also to pay for whatever facilities and other tertiary things he deemed necessary to help rebuild the program. His recruiting base would be top-notch: The state of Texas had long been hailed as among the best when it came to high school football talent.

In late November — just as Brown had begun to falter down the stretch of what was looking more and more like his last year as the Texas coach — came the public airing of what was the truest barometer of Saban’s feelings. In an interview with The Wall Street Journal, Terry Saban was careful to maintain that she and her husband would indeed stay at Alabama. In a moment of candor, she issued a warning shot: “You come to a crossroads and the expectations get so great, people get spoiled by success, and there starts to be a lack of appreciation,†she told the paper. “We’re kind of there now.â€

The University of Alabama’s power brokers by this time knew their coach well. Like their predecessors at Michigan State and L.S.U., they, too, understood his restlessness and need to feel appreciated. After the 2012 national championship, they’d begun to feel jittery. In early 2013, they approached Saban. “We asked him what we could do to help him,†one trustee says. The answer came that spring.

The Crimson Tide Foundation is a nonprofit booster organization that is led by Paul Bryant Jr., the intensely private son of Alabama’s legendary coach, the founder of a bank that bears his name and perhaps the university’s most powerful trustee. Bill Battle, who had replaced Moore as Alabama’s athletics director, is the nonprofit’s president. Angus Cooper, now an emeritus trustee and perhaps Saban’s most trusted confidant among the Alabama power elite, is a vice president.

In March 2013, the foundation agreed to purchase Saban’s house for $3.1 million, roughly $200,000 more than he paid for it in 2007. The Sabans, of course, would be allowed to continue to live there. Buying a coach’s house was nothing new at Alabama: The university had owned both of Paul Bryant’s homes. Various Alabama trustees say that this purchase — as well as its timing — was a gesture of goodwill. It also, they say, helped Saban out a bit when he needed it financially, perhaps because of some real estate decisions in recent years that reportedly hadn’t quite panned out as planned.

The university didn’t stop with the house. Around the same time that Terry Saban made her comments to The Wall Street Journal, and right before the 2013 Iron Bowl, Battle approached Nick Saban about a revised contract, one that would provide him with a raise and an extension. As the Texas rumors burned on, Saban told Battle that he was too focused on the rest of the season to talk about his contract. Some months later, Battle admitted to The Tuscaloosa News that at that point, “I was worried about it, I’ll tell you that.â€

One thing Alabama had going in its favor was that the University of Texas was in turmoil in late 2013. The university’s president was under pressure to resign, and the board of regents had become an unhealthy and unproductive hive of infighting. The athletic director, Dodds, had announced his retirement in the middle of the season. Though most assumed that Brown would resign or be fired at the end of the season, no one knew his fate for sure, or how protracted the process would be. This being the land of the independent and entrepreneurial, a few prominent Texas boosters used the uncertainty to talk to, and lobby for, their own preferred head coaching candidates. “To say it was dysfunctional would be about the highest-class way you could describe it,†the Texas booster Red McCombs says.

In November, Steve Patterson, the former president and general manager of the N.B.A.’s Portland Trail Blazers, became the university’s athletic director, replacing Dodds. Patterson was tasked with cleaning up the mess at Texas, something he would soon begin to do. Of course, he had come to Texas well after the Sexton call with Tom Hicks and Hall. It wasn’t too long after Patterson had taken the job at Texas that Sexton called him, too.

Patterson says he believes he knew what Sexton was up to. “I’ve known Jimmy for 30 years,†he says. “I told him if he wanted to come here and drink bourbon and eat barbecue and talk about Saban, that’d be fine. But I told him not to come here if he just wanted to get Saban an extension and a raise at Alabama, which I thought was his intention all along.

“Of course, Jimmy took great affront to that, which is fine. He was just doing his job. But that was the end of the conversation. I never talked to Saban and we never made an offer.â€

Publicly, though, the Saban-to-Texas rumors were only heating up then. In early December, an Oklahoma City broadcaster named Dean Blevins posted a message on Twitter that claimed Saban had been offered a 10-year deal by Texas for $100 million and a small piece of the Longhorn Network. Right around the same time, Stefan Stevenson, a sports reporter at The Fort Worth Star-Telegram, posted a tweet that read: “Source close to Texas executive council of regents says Nick Saban will be next Longhorns coach.â€

Stevenson, to this day, doesn’t back down from the information in that tweet. “I had a good source, someone on the athletics staff, and I absolutely believed the source was certain,†he says. “I wouldn’t have tweeted it if I didn’t believe the source believed it.â€

What Stevenson wasn’t prepared for was the hell storm that ensued on the Internet, which caused even those who had been dead certain that Saban would stay at Alabama to waver a bit in their conviction, and heaped much derision on its originator. “I regretted tweeting it almost immediately,†he says. “But not because I didn’t think it was true.â€

The common belief among Texas regents was that one or more “rogue†boosters were talking to Sexton behind the scenes. And given the free-for-all chaos from which the Texas leadership was just beginning to emerge, that thesis has some merit.

Given the lack of authority that boosters had in hiring a new coach, any deal with Saban would have been hard for any of them to pull off alone, or even as a group. Saban denied having contact with anyone at Texas. A few weeks later, though, a man described as a “Longhorn lifer and big donor†told The Austin American-Statesman: “The funny thing is, they had Saban this time. He was coming. Only problem was, there was no formal offer from U.T. Patterson was the only one who could do that.â€

On Dec. 13, 2013, Alabama gave Saban a new contract, once again the largest ever in college football, that would pay him $6.9 million a year — with possible performance bonuses of up to $700,000 a year — through Jan. 31, 2022, when he would be 70 years old.

The next afternoon, Mack Brown officially resigned as the head coach at Texas.

Hmmmm,

Jimmy Sexton worked TEXAS for a raise. . . .did Saban "think" about TEXAS?  Yep. . .that's called flirting.

At the end of the day, if you are really trying to sell that TEXAS offered $100 million for 10 years (30% more than TEXAS) and Saban passed,. . . . .I've got some an ocean view property in Arizona.

 

[Embrey]

Darrell McPhaul is a good guy. I know him personally. I know that in times past his behavior on this board was unacceptable. I told him so myself.

He was in a dark place. We've all been in a dark place before, I would suspect. I know I have. I have not always been the kind of person I prefer to be. But by the grace of God, we are lifted through those times.

Today, Darrell is doing extremely well. His issues with a demon we all know are behind him, although it will always be something he must combat. He has simply filled his life with a purpose greater than the demon he's faced. He's turned his life around, works for me some and full time for an Austin church. I applaud the guy.

I'm not asking anyone for anything here. But perhaps a little understanding will go a ways.

Just to be clear, I don't know Darrell but I really enjoyed his columns and his opinions. The rest I never knew about but taking all that in, I am glad he is better. I was just being a smart ass because I have seen the debate over what really happened with Saban on this board and others. I knew what was coming. I never understood why it is so important to deny that he almost took the job. I will leave it at that.

 

[Sirhornsalot]

Hmmmm,

Jimmy Sexton worked TEXAS for a raise. . . .did Saban "think" about TEXAS?  Yep. . .that's called flirting.

At the end of the day, if you are really trying to sell that TEXAS offered $100 million for 10 years (30% more than TEXAS) and Saban passed,. . . . .I've got some an ocean view property in Arizona.

No, you don't have any property for anyone, cheese. You're just attempting a recovery and it's just ridiculous.

You said "urban legend." LOL I answered with New York Times. Can you whiff any harder than that?

You said it wasn't well documented, people just screamed it on the internet. LOL The NYT story lays it out in grand detail . . . SO MUCH SO that you chose to use it to base your latest attempt at a point on, LOL, apparently ignoring the corner you backed yourself into.

No one ever said there was a contract to sign. Thats just your straw man. Sexton was the agent. It got so serious that Bama responded (which you also whiff on LOL) but you SPIN it to be flirting.

You need a towel. lol

 

[North Texas Golfer]

Time for a new question before this thread really goes south.

If we had hired Saban instead of Strong, we would have had to make all the same excuses for him as has been made for Charlie?

 

[Sirhornsalot]

Time for a new question before this thread really goes south.

If we had hired Saban instead of Strong, we would have had to make all the same excuses for him as has been made for Charlie?

I don't think we would be viewing Saban as favorably as we view Strong right now.

Saban's approach is light years different than Charlie's and from where I sit, it seems it's Strong's character, how he handles his players and insists on discipline, that draws our affection for him. I don't think Saban would do that for us. In fact, we might be disgusted with him by now by some of his antics.

Now, if you're asking if Saban has the same luck win-wise as Charlie, heck, I don't know. We'd certainly have a cupboard full of talent, like we do now. 

 

[Embrey]

Time for a new question before this thread really goes south.

It won't go south. This argument has been going on for a long time and I suppose some day we'll see echeese and SHA fist fighting at a retirement home about this very subject. Then they will crack a beer and root for Texas.

 

[Sirhornsalot]

For the record. Saban's raise sat on his desk in the form of a contract to be signed. It sat there several days until the blow up with Mack at Texas. When it was clear caca was hitting the fan at Texas, Saban signed the contract.

If Saban was just working the thing for a raise, why not just sign the raise you got yourself the moment you had it? Why wait? Are you flirting with apparently letting the offer be rescinded for some reason, or are you trying to make something else actually happen?

 

[MBHORNSFAN]

Oh look an internet fight and i'm not involved... feels good man... h34r:

 

[North Texas Golfer]

I don't think we would be viewing Saban as favorably as we view Strong right now.

Saban's approach is light years different than Charlie's and from where I sit, it seems it's Strong's character, how he handles his players and insists on discipline, that draws our affection for him. I don't think Saban would do that for us. In fact, we might be disgusted with him by now by some of his antics.

Now, if you're asking if Saban has the same luck win-wise as Charlie, heck, I don't know. We'd certainly have a cupboard full of talent, like we do now. 

Sorry, I should have been more clear with my question. 

Yea, I really was asking if we thought Saban would have had the same "lack of success" as Strong. 

I'm going with "no way in hell". 

 

[Sirhornsalot]

It won't go south. This argument has been going on for a long time and I suppose some day we'll see echeese and SHA fist fighting at a retirement home about this very subject. Then they will crack a beer and root for Texas.

I hold no animosity toward Chuck. I've met him and like him. I didn't always agree with my mother, either, but as far as I'm concerned she hung the moon.

Chuck's okay in my book. I just don't always buy what he sells, especially when I know better. But he is a very sharp guy and I agree with him more often than not.

 

[Sirhornsalot]

Oh look an internet fight and i'm not involved... feels good man... h34r:

You know you miss "US"  LOL

 

[Chris Flanagan]

Look, I know Herman would be a great hire and Saban will most likely not leave Alabama. BUT!!!!

He could cement his legend by doing it at a another school. It is easier to win the Big 12 than the SEC. 

Somebody had to bring this up. 

 

[mctmatt]

You don't call Saban to ask if he would be interested in a Coaching Job....He calls you and tells you that he is interested in being your next Coach...Yeah, he is that powerful now! 

 

[echeese]

No, you don't have any property for anyone, cheese. You're just attempting a recovery and it's just ridiculous.

You said "urban legend." LOL I answered with New York Times. Can you whiff any harder than that?

You said it wasn't well documented, people just screamed it on the internet. LOL The NYT story lays it out in grand detail . . . SO MUCH SO that you chose to use it to base your latest attempt at a point on, LOL, apparently ignoring the corner you backed yourself into.

No one ever said there was a contract to sign. Thats just your straw man. Sexton was the agent. It got so serious that Bama responded (which you also whiff on LOL) but you SPIN it to be flirting.

You need a towel. lol

 

mark,

Your need to try and turn this into personal attacks pretty much sums up the validity of your comments.   I am reminded never wrestle with a pig. . .you both get dirty and the pig likes it.

I will point out that the NY Times is one of the least credible sources in news.  . .. their editor even admitted recently they need to do a much better job of being journalists . . . ... and they have never been a sports site of any importance.

You are offended I highlighted the article you want to hang your hat on . . . . . .oh well.    

 

 

[echeese]

Oh look an internet fight and i'm not involved... feels good man... h34r:

One sided, not going there. . . . .

 

[DBut82]

Sorry, I should have been more clear with my question. 

Yea, I really was asking if we thought Saban would have had the same "lack of success" as Strong. 

I'm going with "no way in hell". 

Saban's names carries WAAAAYYYYYY more weight than Charlie's perhaps ever will.  With that being said, I doubt Saban comes in and cleans house the way that Charlie did. SEC tends to allow bad apples the opportunity for success on the football field regardless of any character issues. Also, IF Saban was in Strong's position with the exact same record in year 3, he would be afforded the opportunity to fix it, well, because he's Nick Saban and his past successes speak for themselves...

 

[Sirhornsalot]

 

mark,

Your need to try and turn this into personal attacks pretty much sums up the validity of your comments.   I am reminded never wrestle with a pig. . .you both get dirty and the pig likes it.

I will point out that the NY Times is one of the least credible sources in news.  . .. their editor even admitted recently they need to do a much better job of being journalists . . . ... and they have never been a sports site of any importance.

You are offended I highlighted the article you want to hang your hat on . . . . . .oh well.    

 

Except, you cannot point to a single "personal" attack I've made. Another straw man from you. Ya know, if we ever want to torture you just for kicks, we'll forbid you somehow from turning to the straw man. LOL

You won't point to anything personal I've said because you can't.

So what do you do with this post? You attack the messenger. When you can't win a debate, you go for the messenger. It's what liberals do. Have no idea why you employ it. Having run newsrooms myself for 17 years, and being a conservative, I can inform you that the NYT is often referred to as "the nation's newspaper" for very good reason. Do they have problems on Page 1? Sure. But we're not dealing with Page 1 here, are we? Please tell me, what does a liberal care about a Saban-Texas story anyway? lol

I was never offended by you using my link to move your goalposts. I just thought it was funny and ironic at the same time. That was classic stuff. LOL

I didn't hang my hat on anything. I googled and clicked the first link I found, then posted it. It took .4 seconds to do. Yes, thats the time it took to disprove your point.

He who posts last does not mean they win. There's a reason they stop fights in boxing. You could probably use some of that right about now. lol