How Baylor Happened

[primal defense]

. Fans can dislike BU, but they wield clout politically and otherwise.

Bingo!


Texas politicians ban[SIZE=small][edit][/SIZE]


After the SEC announced their intent to leave the CFA, the Big 8 and SWC members re-opened discussions to sell their rights together. "The Baylor Project" by Barry G. Hankins and Donald D. Schmeltekoff (page 68) states that on February 11, 1994, SWC member schools' leaders met a few Big 8 leaders in Dallas to discuss potentially selling both leagues' media content in a package deal. Discussions broke down on February 16, reportedly over UT's interest in the Pac-10. The Big Eight began negotiating a deal that would not include the full SWC as a partner and Texas A&M approached the SEC.[18]

In Texas, word leaked out that UT & Texas A&M were close to leaving the SWC; UT to the Pac-10[18] or Big Eight and eventually Texas A&M to the SEC. Texas state senator David Sibley, a Baylor alumnus and member of the very powerful Senate Finance Committee, approached UT Chancellor Bill Cunningham and asked him pointedly whether UT planned to leave the SWC on its own for the Big Eight. Cunningham tried to change the subject. Ultimately he did not deny it.[9]

Sibley approached LT Governor Bob Bullock, a Texas Tech and Baylor alumnus. Texas state senator John Montford of Lubbock was equally motivated to protect Texas Tech's path to the Big 12. The trio put together a group of legislators who worked to threaten Texas and Texas A&M's access to the state of Texas's Permanent University Fund.[9]

Bullock called together a meeting of supportive legislators as well as UT's and Texas A&M's leaders on February 20, 1994.[19] UT Chancellor William Cunningham admitted that Texas planned to join the Big Eight[9] and A&M's leadership still targeted the SEC.[9]

A deal was worked out where all four schools would go together to the Big 12. A&M was convinced not to pursue SEC membership (LSU was prepared to sponsor the Aggies) in return for Bullock finding the votes to approve the construction of Reed Arena. Baylor and Texas Tech would join the Aggies in coming with UT into the new version of the Big Eight.[9]

Texas's Governor Ann Richards, a Baylor and UT alumna, is often credited with getting Baylor included, but, was absent from the February 20 meeting[9] and no investigative reports confirm her active involvement. The Baylor Report claimed that she presented herself as neutral. Richards' former Chief of Staff, John Fainter, is on record saying "She just was not involved to any great degree in working that out...I'd have to say she was informed, but she wasn't pounding the table or anything like that." Richards was aware of the public perception of her involvement and the thought amused her.[20])

UT officials informed the Big Eight leadership that the Austin school was now receptive to an invitation and the Big Eight issued invitations to Texas, Texas A&M, Baylor, and Texas Tech. All four schools quickly accepted.[18]

At the time of the deal, Texas politicians denied any coercion took place. Over the years, investigative reporters challenged that notion. The idea that Bullock and the state government coerced A&M to join and forced UT to take Tech and Baylor to the Big 12 has constantly been downplayed by Cunningham,[20] but former UT president Robert Berdahl claimed that UT was threatened. “As I recall, it wasn't a very veiled threat to cut budgets if Tech was left behind.”[9]

Baylor President Herb Reynolds thanked Bullock and the other politicians for helping Baylor get into the conference. Despite Baylor's strong credentials, clearly Reynolds felt the politicians played a key role in getting the Bears and Texas Tech into the new conference.[21] The minutes of the February 23, 1994 meeting of the Baylor Board of Regents where the Big 12's invitation was accepted state, "Baylor University owes a strong debt of gratitude to Lt. Governor Bob Bullock, Senator David Sibley, Senator John Montford, Representative Rob Junell, and other legislators for their invaluable assistance during the deliberations leading to the acceptance of the invitations."[22]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Big_12_Conference

 

[Sirhornsalot]

We were still mediocre. If was frustrating all year long for the other team to take the opening drive for a TD and the defense almost blew the first OU game. 

The defense was worse last year than Orlando's first year yet we won more games. It shows how important the quarterback is to wins.

The following are the points we allowed, by game. As you will see, it is HARDLY mediocre in this day and age and in this conference. By contrast, LSU and aggy, both in the vaunted SEC and considered to have good defenses, both gave up 70+ in one game. It was the defense that made it possible to beat OU and their Heisman QB and collection of sprinters on the outside. 

34

21

14

16

19

45 (OU)

17

38

42

10

17

39

21

Here's Bama:

14

7

7

23

14

31

10

21

0

0

21

28

34

44

 

[Sirhornsalot]

...and while we're talking about "kicking BU out of the Big 12" for Briles' alleged transgressions, why didn't the Big 8 kick OU out back in '89? Switzer's last years on campus were troubling, to say the least; drug-dealing, gun-running, prostitution in dorm rooms, etc. NCAA should've thrown the book at them, but didn't. 

https://www.si.com/vault/1989/02/27/119470/you-reap-what-you-sow-oklahoma-has-paid-the-price-for-the-anything-goes-attitude-that-coach-barry-switzer-has-allowed-to-take-root

Would ANYONE on this board be able to speak for the Big 8 BOR from 30 years ago? Yet, no answer is going to imply you're right?

Kicking BU out the conference was NEVER because of Art Briles. It was the rape culture, the fact that women were suffering without consequence – it was the entire university from top to bottom. All of this happens during the "Me-too" movement in a highly political environment.

ESPN exists today while it didn't in 1977 or whatever.

 

[J.B. TexasEx]

Would ANYONE on this board be able to speak for the Big 8 BOR from 30 years ago? Yet, no answer is going to imply you're right?

Kicking BU out the conference was NEVER because of Art Briles. It was the rape culture, the fact that women were suffering without consequence – it was the entire university from top to bottom. All of this happens during the "Me-too" movement in a highly political environment.

ESPN exists today while it didn't in 1977 or whatever.

I am right about the hypocrisy of continuing to fraternize with OU and their thug culture.

Money talks, BS walks. BU ain't going anywhere.

 

[primal defense]

The following are the points we allowed, by game. As you will see, it is HARDLY mediocre in this day and age and in this conference. By contrast, LSU and aggy, both in the vaunted SEC and considered to have good defenses, both gave up 70+ in one game. It was the defense that made it possible to beat OU and their Heisman QB and collection of sprinters on the outside. 

34

21

14

16

19

45 (OU)

17

38

42

10

17

39

21

Here's Bama:

14

7

7

23

14

31

10

21

0

0

21

28

34

44

UT defense was 67th in total defense, 55th in sacks, 79th in passing efficiency which all reflect that it was a middle of the road defense last year. I believe those stats are going to be inflated because of the Big 12 offenses. 

In order to compete for a NC which is the goal that we need to improve. Clemson was 5th in total defense last year and Alabama was 16th.

 

[Sirhornsalot]

UT defense was 67th in total defense, 55th in sacks, 79th in passing efficiency which all reflect that it was a middle of the road defense last year. I believe those stats are going to be inflated because of the Big 12 offenses. 

In order to compete for a NC which is the goal that we need to improve. Clemson was 5th in total defense last year and Alabama was 16th.

Just noticing how you've now gone from "mediocre" in previous posts to now they were "middle of the road." I suppose if I post once or twice more, we'll end in agreement. lol

OU has competed for national championships with defenses that were so bad, you refuse to list them in your point. lol

 

[Sirhornsalot]

I am right about the hypocrisy of continuing to fraternize with OU and their thug culture.

Money talks, BS walks. BU ain't going anywhere.

Thats great but nobody has claimed BU was going anywhere. 

Texas was contemplating leaving the conference. I don't speak for BU but I would imagine they'd stay put if we had done that.

 

[MikeV73]

Just noticing how you've now gone from "mediocre" in previous posts to now they were "middle of the road." I suppose if I post once or twice more, we'll end in agreement. lol

OU has competed for national championships with defenses that were so bad, you refuse to list them in your point. lol

Mediocre is about the same as middle of the road in my book.  The D showed up at times, and disappointed at times.  Hopefully they will become more consistently good this season.

 

[primal defense]

Just noticing how you've now gone from "mediocre" in previous posts to now they were "middle of the road." I suppose if I post once or twice more, we'll end in agreement. lol

OU has competed for national championships with defenses that were so bad, you refuse to list them in your point. lol

Coming from the man who said that we had a lights out defense last year. LOL  The definition of "mediocre" is moderate quality which to me means the same as "middle of the road" 

Yes, I didn't say that OU has competed for national championships with their defense the last two years. That's because I want UT to win national champions not just compete. The last two years OU had no chance in the championship series because of their defense. They were also able to go to the playoffs because they had the Heisman winners which you can't count on.

It seems you have lower standards as a UT fan than I do which is fine to each his own. Historically, the National Championship team has a top 20 defense. I believe we have a better chance of winning a national championship with a top 20 or 30 rated defense (inflated because of the Big 12) than the way OU has gone to the playoffs the last two years. It looks like Lincoln Riley agrees with me since he fired his defensive coordinator. 

 

[Sirhornsalot]

Coming from the man who said that we had a lights out defense last year. LOL  The definition of "mediocre" is moderate quality which to me means the same as "middle of the road" 

Yes, I didn't say that OU has competed for national championships with their defense the last two years. That's because I want UT to win national champions not just compete. The last two years OU had no chance in the championship series because of their defense. They were also able to go to the playoffs because they had the Heisman winners which you can't count on.

It seems you have lower standards as a UT fan than I do which is fine to each his own. Historically, the National Championship team has a top 20 defense. I believe we have a better chance of winning a national championship with a top 20 or 30 rated defense (inflated because of the Big 12) than the way OU has gone to the playoffs the last two years. It looks like Lincoln Riley agrees with me since he fired his defensive coordinator. 

PD, you're all over the place. We've just completed an 8-yr drought where we lost to everybody and Kansas at some point. Now you talk about National Championship standards for some reason.

Yeah, we're getting better. But we won't have what you're describing in next year's team. We may as well take a two-year nap, huh?

 

[primal defense]

PD, you're all over the place. We've just completed an 8-yr drought where we lost to everybody and Kansas at some point. Now you talk about National Championship standards for some reason.

Yeah, we're getting better. But we won't have what you're describing in next year's team. We may as well take a two-year nap, huh?

 .We did not break the 8 year drought because of the defense which you termed lights out. LOL it was because of Sam Ellinger.the defense was rated 29th for Herman's first year and we were 7-6. You also know or should know that during that eight year drought we have had bad to lousy play from the QB position.

As far as national championship, I was just answered your post from earlier. You really need to keep you. 

OU has competed for national championships with defenses that were so bad, you refuse to list them in your point. lol

As far as next year's defense, all I know we have a lot of talented young guys and Herman said in his press conference is that the team is going to need a lot of young guys to step up.

 

[Sirhornsalot]

 .We did not break the 8 year drought because of the defense which you termed lights out. LOL it was because of Sam Ellinger.the defense was rated 29th for Herman's first year and we were 7-6. You also know or should know that during that eight year drought we have had bad to lousy play from the QB position.

As far as national championship, I was just answered your post from earlier. You really need to keep you. 

OU has competed for national championships with defenses that were so bad, you refuse to list them in your point. lol

As far as next year's defense, all I know we have a lot of talented young guys and Herman said in his press conference is that the team is going to need a lot of young guys to step up.

When our big draft choices went to the NFL, they came from the defensive side and Ehlinger was running for his life on every play. Defense kept us in games.

But you're free to believe whatever you want. I'm out.

 

[java]

I’m wondering where Georgia’s defense ranked?  We utterly dominated them from bell to bell, and it had absolutely nothing to do with Georgia overlooking us. 

Georgia was outcoached, outplayed, and out hustled. They were beaten soundly, and they are a smash mouth SEC team, yet we also beat most Big 12 teams and should have beaten all of them, I think. 

What is unique about this Texas team?  I don’t know, but I love it. I think it’s special. We may not be there yet, but we are on our way. 

Note:  The defense would have better stats if we played 3 games against the Little Sisters of the Poor. 

Hook ‘em!

 

[doc longhorn]

Notwithstanding the Baylor/SWC debacle, BU had become a pariah in UT's eyes.  There were elements of the UT admin that did not care what BU or the Big 12 did, but cared only what UT would do.  The unknown fact is UT was perilously close to bolting to the PAC 12.  Primarily because of BU, the WPD and Waco itself.  And, yes, because of aggy shenanigans.  This is when the media stepped in, as the LHN was threatened and "future" plans as well.  I'll discuss this later.

The bottom line, as always, was money.  All schools are whores, even rich ones like UT.  Well, a little ego as well.  The arrogance accusations at UT are not far fetched.

 

[J.B. TexasEx]

Notwithstanding the Baylor/SWC debacle, BU had become a pariah in UT's eyes.  There were elements of the UT admin that did not care what BU or the Big 12 did, but cared only what UT would do.  The unknown fact is UT was perilously close to bolting to the PAC 12.  Primarily because of BU, the WPD and Waco itself.  And, yes, because of aggy shenanigans.  This is when the media stepped in, as the LHN was threatened and "future" plans as well.  I'll discuss this later.

The bottom line, as always, was money.  All schools are whores, even rich ones like UT.  Well, a little ego as well.  The arrogance accusations at UT are not far fetched.

UT's flirtation with the Pac-12 happened before the BU and Art Briles problem.

I can foresee the Big 12 and Pac-12 pooling their media rights before the next round of contracts are negotiated IF it's advantageous to UT. My hope is there's no merger because none of those teams excite me - except USC.

aggy is aggy. I understand why they didn't want to be dragged west along with UT. They're a much better fit with SEC rednecks.

 

[Bear19]

aggy is aggy. I understand why they didn't want to be dragged west along with UT. They're a much better fit with SEC bagmen.

FIFY

 

[J.B. TexasEx]

FIFY

LOL....true dat. Only USC has bagmen in the Pac-12. 

 

[Sirhornsalot]

LOL....true dat. Only USC has bagmen in the Pac-12. 

Oregon says hi

I would not want the Pac-12. Just too far away, games too late, no natural rivalries. Can you imagine a night game with Wash State? 

Independent – schedule anybody you want, rack up the wins, go bowling/CFP. Look at how ND has been treated.

 

[Baron]

Oregon says hi

I would not want the Pac-12. Just too far away, games too late, no natural rivalries. Can you imagine a night game with Wash State? 

Independent – schedule anybody you want, rack up the wins, go bowling/CFP. Look at how ND has been treated.

I'm thinking Big 10 or ACC. Us and ou to the Big 10 or us and ND to the ACC.

 

[Bear19]

Oregon says hi

I would not want the Pac-12. Just too far away, games too late, no natural rivalries. Can you imagine a night game with Wash State? 

Independent – schedule anybody you want, rack up the wins, go bowling/CFP. Look at how ND has been treated.

Or just stay in the Big12.