Jump to content
Search In
  • More options...
Find results that contain...
Find results in...

Should the big 12 add UCF?


ridik01
 Share

Recommended Posts

I don't think you ever had any such chance. Notre Dame began talking to the ACC many years ago. And probably since BC became the ACC's 12th, the ND leadership up to Father Jenkins knew that when push came to shove with conference realignment, ND would take the ACC.

 

And with ND coming aboard the ACC even as a half member in football, there is no way any of those schools would leave the ACC.

 

Great point. Notre Dame brings more $$$ and stability to the ACC than any other school could in the nation.

 

That also includes Texas.

 

The addition of Notre Dame to the ACC is the crown jewel for the conference. Even without ND's inclusion to a conference championship - as all ND is concerned about is being able to get into the Playoffs. Win all of the games, and get into the playoffs. Why is that not UT's focus as well?

 

UT is in a weak conference - that's not a problem - that's an opportunity!

 

Just get a great coach, WIN all of your games, and get into the playoffs... Why is this not the goal? Why the focus on the Big 12 and the conference?

 

Nobody cares or remembers who won the conference championship in 19xx or 20xx. You have a clear path to a NC without the inclusion of UCF or The University of Phoenix or whatever other school - and without a meaningless conference championship.

 

You're UT. If you are undefeated, you are in the NC game. What is the problem with this?

Edited by irishfred
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 52
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

I understand the arguments for UCF & Cincy, but I better understand the arguments against them. Until the playoffs or D4 require a CCG, the B12 is way better off waiting for the financial pressures of the next 8-10 years to catch up with the ACC. If realignment happens, it will be as the GORs are expiring, with the B1G taking 2 from the ACC, then the SEC taking 2, and finally the B12 taking 6. The ACC's financial structure is considerably weaker than the B12's, which will eventually be weaker than the B1G's and the SEC's. ND's participation only delayed the eventual result, not eliminated it. Look at the conference TV payout projections. The absorption/merger with some of the ACC will cure that. (that is why FSU can't compete with Texas if we decide we want Fisher:)) ND will probably still be affiliated with the eastern half of the B12/ACC at that time.

 

But I still think that eventually the exclusive criteria for gaining membership in the D4. when it happens, will eliminate the need for realignment. Every one of the power 5 conferences have their weak sisters, and the criteria will be set such that those teams won't be admitted. Regional leagues will be formed across conference affiliations, with league championship games replacing CCGs. Conference affiliations, TV contracts, & GORs can remain intact. They won't matter and can be dealt with over time as the conferences see fit. Basketball and the spring sports will remain as they are, at least for now.

 

Until D4 or realignment happen, the best thing the B12 can do is to schedule great OCC games to vastly improve the SOS of the conference and improve its perception.

Edited by Old Tascosa
Link to comment
Share on other sites

-50k students with a massive alumni base.

-Expanding their stadium.

-Based in Orlando.

-Opens Florida up for recruiting.

-Great trips for the teams.

-Massive television base in Florida.

-Actually a respectable school in Florida for academics.

-SHOWED TONIGHT THEY CAN HANG WITH THE BIG BOYS!

 

Why not? They would pounce on the offer in a heart beat.

 

Yes, but only under two conditions:

 

1. ESPN and FOX give Big 12 a pro rata increase for adding two teams (UCF and Cincinnati for me) so it doesn't adversely effect our TV revenues and bottom lines.

2. If it becomes clear that not having a Big 12 Conference Championship is hurting our chances of securing a CFB Playoff spot

 

Otherwise, don't bother expanding right now. No benefit or incentive for doing it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Bottomline is Dodds screwed the pooch on this deal. TCU was a stupid add because OU/UT/TT already controlled the D/FW TV market. They brought us jack.

 

We should have brought in Louisville and expanded our reach into the southeast. We should have got FSU, Miami, Clemson, or Georgia Tech when we had the chance.

 

Agree. Adding TCU looked like a lose A&M, add another TX school decision. They are proving to be a liability and really don't deliver the DFW market.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Agree. Adding TCU looked like a lose A&M, add another TX school decision. They are proving to be a liability and really don't deliver the DFW market.

 

The UT vs TCU game in 2012 was 1/2 empty at DKR.

 

It was a Thanksgiving game.

 

TCU is 2.5 hours away.

 

It was embarrassing to see -and this is what they are:

 

http://www.tcu360.com/football/2013/10/18743.patterson-fans-%E2%80%9Cwe-all-have-do-our-part%E2%80%9D

 

I'm sure the addition of UCF would mean that HEB would be giving away 2 tickets to UCF/UT with the purchase of a Rotisserie Chicken...

Edited by irishfred
Link to comment
Share on other sites

UCF is no Boise, UCF is the real deal and a diamond in the rough. Much more potential than USF, better facilities, bigger school, more traditional campus. USF has gone as high as it can go. UCF is going to be like Miami was in the 80's in a few years. They will be the reason why the "U" never gets back to its past glory because, UCF will be able to recruit some of the studs that would fall to Miami to UCF because of better facilities, still in the state of Florida and in a city environment. (Yes, I know much of the same could apply to USF too) but UCF is set up much better to capitalize on this than USF)

 

Boise did not have the demographics to sustain the success and after Petersen leaving, they will fall off the national radar in the next few years. UCF has much better talent available near them and a larger media market.

 

Grab UCF and Cincy to get to 12. Both of these schools have high ceilings, UCF higher than Cincy. Short term it will seem like a yawner. In 5-7 years it will be considered a steal.

 

Totally agree!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The UT vs TCU game in 2012 was 1/2 empty at DKR.

 

It was a Thanksgiving game.

 

TCU is 2.5 hours away.

 

It was embarrassing to see -and this is what they are:

 

http://www.tcu360.com/football/2013/10/18743.patterson-fans-%E2%80%9Cwe-all-have-do-our-part%E2%80%9D

 

I'm sure the addition of UCF would mean that HEB would be giving away 2 tickets to UCF/UT with the purchase of a Rotisserie Chicken...

The addition of UCF would set up a perfect future raid of the ACC. The ACC is not going to last, they barely missed complete death. The ACC is gearing for a BBall first conference signing their own death warrants.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

IMHO, realignment / expansion is imperative. I understand the arguments against UCF, USF, Cincy,etc but it's all about TV sets and money. While UT is flush with money, what about Baylor or TCU or WVa. At ten members the Big 12 is vulnerable! Hell every couple of months or so up here in Ohio, there is an article in one of the papers speculating about UT to the BIG 10. It made no sense to me, or to my OSU friends to add Rutgers and MD to the BIG10 until we heard the BTN payout to EACH school was going to go from 17 mil to 28 mil per year. Expand or eventually be cherry picked apart by the more progressive and aggressive conferences.

 

Could you imagine our guys traveling 1000 miles for each game and playing in temperatures of -10 to 20 degrees during the last portion of the season.....I couldn't! That just spells trouble for us!

The Big 10 is the death for us IMO.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

That's incorrect. Announced attendance was 95k for the TCU game and UT still averaged over 100k in 2012.

 

Don't exaggerate

 

The actual attendance was NO WAY near 95k - at least that is what it looked like. It looked pathetic - the fans around me noticed as well.

 

I'll dig up a photo - it was so marked that I snapped one in the middle of the 2nd quarter. It looked like swiss cheese in the stadium.

 

It's no matter. We stayed until the end.

 

I'll concede that it was not 1/2 full. I embellished that. But it was not 95K either.

Edited by irishfred
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1. What exactly is your point Fred?

 

2. TCU having "BCS" experience is 101% irrelevant. Its all about how many TV sets you deliver in a broadcast deal. TCU brings nothing to table from that perspective.

 

UCF and Cincinnati

The Orlando TV Market brings 1.5 million TV sets

The Cincy TV Market brings 915,000 TV sets.

 

For Arguments sake, the Louisville market is 668,000 TV sets.

 

By comparison, when we added TCU and WVU

 

The D/FW TV Market - Net gain of zero, since this was already Big 12 saturated and factored in

The Charleston/Huntington TV Market - 480,000

 

So, in summary, thanks to DeLoss Dodds

 

We left 180,000 to almost 800,000 TV sets off the table when contract talks came.

 

Now, because of "tradition"

 

We would scoff at the addition of 2.5 million more TV sets?

 

That is "DeLoss Dodds" logic, and its junk.

Edited by Whisenant
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ill make it simple for everyone, Ut will go to the pac 12. Few years ago there was a chance it could happen but dodds wasn't on board, now dodds is out. Bring in Patterson and what school did Patterson come from Arizona st and the pac 12.

 

Ive said this before there will be 4 16 team conferences soon and that's where I bet texas goes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ill make it simple for everyone, Ut will go to the pac 12. Few years ago there was a chance it could happen but dodds wasn't on board, now dodds is out. Bring in Patterson and what school did Patterson come from Arizona st and the pac 12.

 

Ive said this before there will be 4 16 team conferences soon and that's where I bet texas goes.

 

No, this was a done deal until the Aggies torpedoed it and everyone backed off under the guise of trusting A&M, which was a horrible mistake. A&M then bolted for the SEC, and we replaced them and Missouri, who finally spread its legs far enough for someone to hit it, with WVU and TCU, which flips this argument back to post #37 I just made.

 

Now with the LHN and the Pac's demand of relinquishing 3rd tier rights, that ship has sailed. In the current landscape, youd see Texas either go into the ACC or independent at this point. We are not going to piss away all that ESPN money just to be in bed with the Pac-12.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ill make it simple for everyone, Ut will go to the pac 12. Few years ago there was a chance it could happen but dodds wasn't on board, now dodds is out. Bring in Patterson and what school did Patterson come from Arizona st and the pac 12.

 

Ive said this before there will be 4 16 team conferences soon and that's where I bet texas goes.

You clearly have never been to a PAC game. I want nothing to do with that conference! Their fans are terrible and they very seldom sell out a stadium.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

No, this was a done deal until the Aggies torpedoed it and everyone backed off under the guise of trusting A&M, which was a horrible mistake. A&M then bolted for the SEC, and we replaced them and Missouri, who finally spread its legs far enough for someone to hit it, with WVU and TCU, which flips this argument back to post #37 I just made.

 

Now with the LHN and the Pac's demand of relinquishing 3rd tier rights, that ship has sailed. In the current landscape, youd see Texas either go into the ACC or independent at this point. We are not going to piss away all that ESPN money just to be in bed with the Pac-12.

 

I could see Acc, but independent would not be good, in my opinion.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

UCF is no Boise, UCF is the real deal and a diamond in the rough. Much more potential than USF, better facilities, bigger school, more traditional campus. USF has gone as high as it can go. UCF is going to be like Miami was in the 80's in a few years. They will be the reason why the "U" never gets back to its past glory because, UCF will be able to recruit some of the studs that would fall to Miami to UCF because of better facilities, still in the state of Florida and in a city environment. (Yes, I know much of the same could apply to USF too) but UCF is set up much better to capitalize on this than USF)

 

Boise did not have the demographics to sustain the success and after Petersen leaving, they will fall off the national radar in the next few years. UCF has much better talent available near them and a larger media market.

 

Grab UCF and Cincy to get to 12. Both of these schools have high ceilings, UCF higher than Cincy. Short term it will seem like a yawner. In 5-7 years it will be considered a steal.

 

Miami in the 80's... are you high

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's a fallacy to assume that just because UCF is located in Orlando, they automatically bring the local TV ratings with them. There are studies out there with data pertaining to this (I will try to dig it up). I would assume most TV sets in Orlando won't be tuned in just to see UCF vs Kansas, TCU, KSU, Tech, etc on a weekly basis during the season. They will still watch Florida and FSU first and it won't even be close.

 

The Big 12 doesn't have a conference network so adding teams for their "markets" isn't going to work either. Big 12 is dead in the water and adding Big East leftovers like UCF, Cincy, etc is probably the dumbest thing we can do. Also, the notion we need to add two teams to "get to 12" for a CCG is even worse. That's the only thing I agree with Bowlsby on. Most of the CCGs, except for the SEC, have been failures in terms of attendance, tv ratings, and cost. Playing all every team in your conference in a round robin format, then playing a CCG is going to make getting into the four team playoff a lot harder. Think people!

 

If the Big 12 is going to survive over the long haul, they need to add significantly tougher and more compelling NON CONFERENCE GAMES. Look at the teams KU, Tech, KSU, WVU, Baylor and other Big 12 schools played this year in non conference. Horrible!!! The Big 12 office has encouraged the teams to keep two slots open to schedule ACC teams as part of their scheduling alliance in the future. Not great, but, I would rather have big 12 schools play ACC teams instead of adding two garbage teams and splitting back up into non-equal divisions.

 

WVU has started this trend and has scheduled Pitt, Vtech and even PSU over the next few years.

 

If you want the BEST for UT for ALL SPORTS, that is an associate membership with the ACC similar to Notre Dame's current set up.

 

It's no coincidence UT and ND have scheduled four games vs each other and are in talks to schedule four to six more.

No coincidence Patterson is looking at getting tamu back on the schedule

No coincidence that Texas is looking at adding LAX and men's soccer.

No coincidence UT is looking at building a brand new basketball facility

 

Basketball would be elite

Baseball too

 

If you play ND and four other ACC teams, you will have a BIG TIME schedule to promote the Texas brand across the nation. We would keep OU, add tamu, and probably Tech.

 

Here is a sample schedule

 

ND

OU

Lville

UNC

FSU

Pitt

aggy

tech

baylor/tcu

utsa/texas state/utep

Stanford/Nebraska/Arky

Rice

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1. What exactly is your point Fred?

 

Hire the right coach and start Winning. As in right away. No experiments for the hire.

 

Don't worry about conference realignment. A winning UT can call their shots - for real this time.

 

Everything will work out in that scenerio.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's a fallacy to assume that just because UCF is located in Orlando, they automatically bring the local TV ratings with them. There are studies out there with data pertaining to this (I will try to dig it up). I would assume most TV sets in Orlando won't be tuned in just to see UCF vs Kansas, TCU, KSU, Tech, etc on a weekly basis during the season. They will still watch Florida and FSU first and it won't even be close.

 

The Big 12 doesn't have a conference network so adding teams for their "markets" isn't going to work either. Big 12 is dead in the water and adding Big East leftovers like UCF, Cincy, etc is probably the dumbest thing we can do. Also, the notion we need to add two teams to "get to 12" for a CCG is even worse. That's the only thing I agree with Bowlsby on. Most of the CCGs, except for the SEC, have been failures in terms of attendance, tv ratings, and cost. Playing all every team in your conference in a round robin format, then playing a CCG is going to make getting into the four team playoff a lot harder. Think people!

 

If the Big 12 is going to survive over the long haul, they need to add significantly tougher and more compelling NON CONFERENCE GAMES. Look at the teams KU, Tech, KSU, WVU, Baylor and other Big 12 schools played this year in non conference. Horrible!!! The Big 12 office has encouraged the teams to keep two slots open to schedule ACC teams as part of their scheduling alliance in the future. Not great, but, I would rather have big 12 schools play ACC teams instead of adding two garbage teams and splitting back up into non-equal divisions.

 

WVU has started this trend and has scheduled Pitt, Vtech and even PSU over the next few years.

 

If you want the BEST for UT for ALL SPORTS, that is an associate membership with the ACC similar to Notre Dame's current set up.

 

It's no coincidence UT and ND have scheduled four games vs each other and are in talks to schedule four to six more.

No coincidence Patterson is looking at getting tamu back on the schedule

No coincidence that Texas is looking at adding LAX and men's soccer.

No coincidence UT is looking at building a brand new basketball facility

 

Basketball would be elite

Baseball too

 

If you play ND and four other ACC teams, you will have a BIG TIME schedule to promote the Texas brand across the nation. We would keep OU, add tamu, and probably Tech.

 

Here is a sample schedule

 

ND

OU

Lville

UNC

FSU

Pitt

aggy

tech

baylor/tcu

utsa/texas state/utep

Stanford/Nebraska/Arky

Rice

 

Great post.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's a fallacy to assume that just because UCF is located in Orlando, they automatically bring the local TV ratings with them. There are studies out there with data pertaining to this (I will try to dig it up). I would assume most TV sets in Orlando won't be tuned in just to see UCF vs Kansas, TCU, KSU, Tech, etc on a weekly basis during the season. They will still watch Florida and FSU first and it won't even be close.

 

The Big 12 doesn't have a conference network so adding teams for their "markets" isn't going to work either. Big 12 is dead in the water and adding Big East leftovers like UCF, Cincy, etc is probably the dumbest thing we can do. Also, the notion we need to add two teams to "get to 12" for a CCG is even worse. That's the only thing I agree with Bowlsby on. Most of the CCGs, except for the SEC, have been failures in terms of attendance, tv ratings, and cost. Playing all every team in your conference in a round robin format, then playing a CCG is going to make getting into the four team playoff a lot harder. Think people!

 

If the Big 12 is going to survive over the long haul, they need to add significantly tougher and more compelling NON CONFERENCE GAMES. Look at the teams KU, Tech, KSU, WVU, Baylor and other Big 12 schools played this year in non conference. Horrible!!! The Big 12 office has encouraged the teams to keep two slots open to schedule ACC teams as part of their scheduling alliance in the future. Not great, but, I would rather have big 12 schools play ACC teams instead of adding two garbage teams and splitting back up into non-equal divisions.

 

WVU has started this trend and has scheduled Pitt, Vtech and even PSU over the next few years.

 

If you want the BEST for UT for ALL SPORTS, that is an associate membership with the ACC similar to Notre Dame's current set up.

 

It's no coincidence UT and ND have scheduled four games vs each other and are in talks to schedule four to six more.

No coincidence Patterson is looking at getting tamu back on the schedule

No coincidence that Texas is looking at adding LAX and men's soccer.

No coincidence UT is looking at building a brand new basketball facility

 

Basketball would be elite

Baseball too

 

If you play ND and four other ACC teams, you will have a BIG TIME schedule to promote the Texas brand across the nation. We would keep OU, add tamu, and probably Tech.

 

Here is a sample schedule

 

ND

OU

Lville

UNC

FSU

Pitt

aggy

tech

baylor/tcu

utsa/texas state/utep

Stanford/Nebraska/Arky

Rice

 

I am going to agree with Irishfred that your post is excellent.

 

I have said for some time that as an ND fan, the thing I would most like to see now is Texas in the ACC as we are. I can see why Texas might have strong preferences to stay in the Big 12, but I also believe that all things considered, Texas would come out best in the ACC with ND.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

on a week to week basis, those markets will tune in to watch ohio state and other B1G teams. Not cincy vs ISU, KSU, TCU, Baylor or Okie state.

 

True, but is also true that if UC is in a major conference, UC vs. good teams (say, Texas or OU) will be at least roughly equal draws in the Cincinnati TV market to Ohio St vs. nobodies, including the nobodies in the Big Ten like Minnesota or Rutgers.

 

UC stepped up in league affiliation and schedule will see rather significant increase in ability to draw TV viewers. What it can never hope to do, especially because of the Bengals, is become a major draw to the stadium.

 

In that sense, UC is a better bet that UCF, because right now, the large state of OH has only 1 school in a major conference. FL has 3.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
 Share

🏈 #15 Texas vs. Rice

  • Days
  • Hours
  • Minutes
  • Seconds

Darrell K. Royal - Texas Memorial Stadium
Austin, TX
7:00 PM Kickoff - LHN


  • 2021 Texas Football Schedule

    Week
    Opponent
    W/L
    9/4
    Louisiana
    W 38-18
    9/11
    @Arkansas
    L 21-40
    9/18
    Rice
    9/25
    Texas Tech
    10/2
    @TCU
    10/9
    Oklahoma
    10/16
    Oklahoma State
    10/30
    @Baylor
    11/6
    @Iowa State
    11/13
    Kansas
    11/20
    @West Virginia
    11/27
    Kansas State

Our Affiliation

USATDP_Logo.png

Quick Links

×
×
  • Create New...