A&M - Take a look at me now

[McQ]

Johnny Manziel: Against All Odds - Good Bull Hunting

I loled.

 

[RealtorHorn]

 

[Randolph Duke]

I'm getting the sense Johnny touched someone's tra-la-la.

Aggie Yell Leaders - Touch My Tra La La on Vimeo

 

[RealtorHorn]

I'm getting the sense Johnny touched someone's tra-la-la.
Aggie Yell Leaders - Touch My Tra La La on Vimeo

Just embarrassing.

Duke, helluva story on the 21st Man. Do you ever see a lawsuit coming from Illinois or whatever school it was that created the term "12th Man"?

 

[Randolph Duke]

Just embarrassing.
Duke, helluva story on the 21st Man. Do you ever see a lawsuit coming from Illinois or whatever school it was that created the term "12th Man"?

Iowa. No. No one thought anything about it at the time. It was widely used for years and just became a figure of speech. Here is an article from 1938 http://www.hornsports.com/docs/aggy/DMN_Dec_18_1938.pdf

The 1938 article talks about the UT/aggy game and refers to both fanbases at the teams' "Twelfth men." No one at that time thought anything strange about the fanbase of UT being called "the twelfth man" of UT's team. It was not connected to any individual school or person. In 1939, McQuillen wrote the radio play and changed the facts to make Gill the solitary man on the sideline. No big deal. Everyone then knew it was a fairy tale that wasn't true. Amazingly, over the decades, people began to believe the McQuillen story was actually true, even though the A&M library had all the info necessary to show otherwise. In the 1980's aggy really got all fired up about the story, thinking it was true and put a statue to Gill in front of the stadium. Then the school decided to trademark the name, insisting they had originated it, even though they knew the didn't. No one else knew the real story (or really cared), so no one else said anything. To this day, the school maintains their "official" version is true because they have so much invested in it.

I talked with the SID at Iowa last year for the 100th anniversary of the alumni publication and he said they were thinking about putting something about it in their gameday program, but they never did. They have no claim to the phrase. It was in the public domain for decades and no one laid any claim to it until aggy started telling people they originated the phrase. Eventually the real story will get out and aggy will have some explaining to do. As things are today, no sportswriter wants to deal with it because the aggys are on an upswing. Eventually someone will pick it up and make an issue of it.

Aaron has my next piece and should have it up by the end of the day. Its about how aggy is out little brother and not the other way around as the aggys claim. I dug up the act by the legislature that created the University of Texas, the act that split the PUF and where aggy changed their name from the ag college to TAMU. Once that is out, we will have most of the significant documents related to the creation of UT and the ag school as well as a number of the significant early pics all on the HS server for when anyone needs them if they want to talk smack with the ags and set the record straight about who they are and who we are. I'm wondering just what else people want me to write about.

FYI - Here is a 1926 article about Vanderbilt's twelfth man - http://www.hornsports.com/docs/aggy/DMN_Oct_14_1926.pdf

Here is a 1935 story about Dartmouth's twelfth man - http://www.hornsports.com/docs/aggy/DMN_Dec_2_1935.pdf

here is a 1930 story about the Principal W.H. Adamson of Dallas Oak Cliff High School being known as their "twelfth man" for his inspirational locker room speeches. http://www.hornsports.com/docs/aggy/DMN_October_12_1930.pdf You saw the 1918 story about Navy's twelfth man and the one about Alabama's twelfth man. It was a very commonly used term that was in no way connected to tamu in any significant degree until the 1980s.

 

[RealtorHorn]

Wow. That "honor code" has been in practice for a loooooong time now.

 

[Randolph Duke]

Wow. That "honor code" has been in practice for a loooooong time now.

I've always said that those who like them the most are those who know them the least.

What I don't get is how the administration of their school and the school's attorneys could knowingly file false documents with the federal government in obtaining their trademark on "the 12th Man." I'd love to know who made that decision.

 

[HornNdriftwood]

Iowa. No. No one thought anything about it at the time. It was widely used for years and just became a figure of speech. Here is an article from 1938 http://www.hornsports.com/docs/aggy/DMN_Dec_18_1938.pdf
The 1938 article talks about the UT/aggy game and refers to both fanbases at the teams' "Twelfth men." No one at that time thought anything strange about the fanbase of UT being called "the twelfth man" of UT's team. It was not connected to any individual school or person. In 1939, McQuillen wrote the radio play and changed the facts to make Gill the solitary man on the sideline. No big deal. Everyone then knew it was a fairy tale that wasn't true. Amazingly, over the decades, people began to believe the McQuillen story was actually true, even though the A&M library had all the info necessary to show otherwise. In the 1980's aggy really got all fired up about the story, thinking it was true and put a statue to Gill in front of the stadium. Then the school decided to trademark the name, insisting they had originated it, even though they knew the didn't. No one else knew the real story (or really cared), so no one else said anything. To this day, the school maintains their "official" version is true because they have so much invested in it.

I talked with the SID at Iowa last year for the 100th anniversary of the alumni publication and he said they were thinking about putting something about it in their gameday program, but they never did. They have no claim to the phrase. It was in the public domain for decades and no one laid any claim to it until aggy started telling people they originated the phrase. Eventually the real story will get out and aggy will have some explaining to do. As things are today, no sportswriter wants to deal with it because the aggys are on an upswing. Eventually someone will pick it up and make an issue of it.

Aaron has my next piece and should have it up by the end of the day. Its about how aggy is out little brother and not the other way around as the aggys claim. I dug up the act by the legislature that created the University of Texas, the act that split the PUF and where aggy changed their name from the ag college to TAMU. Once that is out, we will have most of the significant documents related to the creation of UT and the ag school as well as a number of the significant early pics all on the HS server for when anyone needs them if they want to talk smack with the ags and set the record straight about who they are and who we are. I'm wondering just what else people want me to write about.

FYI - Here is a 1926 article about Vanderbilt's twelfth man - http://www.hornsports.com/docs/aggy/DMN_Oct_14_1926.pdf

Here is a 1935 story about Dartmouth's twelfth man - http://www.hornsports.com/docs/aggy/DMN_Dec_2_1935.pdf

here is a 1930 story about the Principal W.H. Adamson of Dallas Oak Cliff High School being known as their "twelfth man" for his inspirational locker room speeches. http://www.hornsports.com/docs/aggy/DMN_October_12_1930.pdf You saw the 1918 story about Navy's twelfth man and the one about Alabama's twelfth man. It was a very commonly used term that was in no way connected to tamu in any significant degree until the 1980s.

Duke

Like you I'm a history buff and as a native Austinite/2nd generation Longhorn who grew up in the 50s & 60s (I remember when UT had a pre-Thanksgiving bonfire), I'm fascinated by the curious behavior of aggy.

I've know for years/decades about Bevo as namesake of the near beer by Anheuser Busch. Regarding the 12th Man, my research has led me to believe the term goes all the way back in American sports history to the

18th century and the game of cricket.

Cricket was so popular at the time of the Revolution that Washington's troops played pick up games at Valley Forge. Cricket may very well have been the first organized collegiate sport. Eastern sport writers in the late 19th century were very familiar with the term because many of the ivy league schools had cricket clubs in the 1800s. It was natural for them to apply the term to football after 1880 when, thanks to Walter Camp, the

rules were changed to make it 11 men per side. Cricket is played by 12 man teams but only 11 take the field. The 12th man is the first (and typically, the only) substitute.

Early collegiate football clubs were lucky to put together an 11 man roster and it wasn't unusual for them to pull a player from among the spectators if someone went down. Sometimes the coach himself would go in if

neccessary. The tradition of someone standing by (but not on the roster) ready to go in if needed goes way back before E. King Gill.

But you can't tell an aggy that.

 

[Randolph Duke]

If you read the aggy website for their official version, they have him standing alone on the sideline. I have no idea where the term originated. So far, the earliest we can find it in print to refer to U.S. college football is 1912. It gets funny when the ags try to explain exactly what they originated in 1922, especially when their school paper was using the term at least as early as 1921. Eventually some reporter is going to want to to take all the info in the story and ask Jason Cook over at tamu. The bottom line is they filed false info under oath with the federal government. Not sure how that squares with their honor code.